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Monday, September 17, 2012

122 Student,
Read the op. ed.
http://ideas.time.com/2012/09/11/is-it-really-the-end-of-men/?iid=op-main-lede

Then view Melissa Harris-Perry's presentation of the topic, personal opinion, and her panelist's thoughts at:
http://ideas.time.com/2012/09/11/is-it-really-the-end-of-men/?iid=op-main-lede
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46979745/vp/49052311#49052311

Then, create a well-organized, personal experience evidence supported response.  Post your response on the blog for extra credit.
Dr. B.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46979745/vp/49052172#49052172

7 comments:

  1. To me, we should not be talking about how women are rising and how men are declining. Instead, we should be working hard to make sure women and men are equal. Women are just catching up. I am proud of them. However, i do not think that it is the end of men, because the majority of the powerful political positions ( President 100 percent, U.S senate 83 percent, and U.S House of Representatives 83 percent) are held by men. Yes women are improving, but it still unfair to see how they are srtuggling to hold powerful positions. We need more women to get elected for the political positions, because all decisions that matter to our national interest are taken by the persons who hold these positions. Until then, women and men are still inequal.

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  2. Well, after watching the interview with the author, I attempted to follow the logic train of the panel, two of which were adept at descriptive terms such as “Like…and like, you know?” I admit it was tough, but in the end they all came across as biased people that need to make the data they are using fit their worldview, rather than objectivity based ideas. It began with the MSNBC interviewer going straight into the completely fictitious war on women.
    This war is just another part of the class warfare tactic being waged in an attempt to be re-elected. There is no war. I say this as I understand both sides of the Abortion argument, and I fully understand that there are zealots on either side. It’s a states issue and if a woman wants to go that route then that’s her choice and she should pay for it, not taxpayers. Birth control is no different. Sex is far from a right guaranteed by the Constitution. Why should we pay for someone to have sex? I have to say that activists like Sandra Fluke do more to hurt the women’s issue and cause division than they help. I also respect the church’s view on not paying for it, even if I don’t agree that using it is bad. Bottom line is I saw this as the interview being used to push a political agenda.
    You know that I agree with you that women have had less than equal treatment, to say the least, since the beginnings of agriculture at least, beginning thousands of years. It wasn’t until the Revolutionary War here in America that women really began letting men know what they were capable of and that they deserved better treatment. Many had fought in the war, followed troops as camp followers and nurses, and thousand more had successfully kept farms running until the war was over.
    As far as the end of men, personally I see the data being made to fit the worldview as I said earlier. Society is changing, and each generation’s view of the sexes is evolving. The 20’s roared, the 30’s tightened up, and the 40’s brought us war where women excelled on the home front. After the war, the men returned and we were back to uptight and twin beds in the 50’s. Peace, Love, and Dope ran the 60’s and 70’s. I personally hated the 80’s, but that was the beginning of Gen X, parents of the Millennium’s. I know this is a condensed way to explain it, but Gen X and their children began to look at society differently than any generation before. Same sex and mixed marriages became socially acceptable. Barefoot and pregnant was not the catchphrase it was for women only a decade or two before.
    Today the Millennium generation looks at men and women as more equal than any before. As more and more of the older generations die off, the antiquated attitudes will disappear. Of course there will always be a few fanatics, but they will be in the minority, not the mainstream.

    Rick (See Part II)

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  3. Part II

    More women than ever are getting a college education and Masters Degrees. I believe this is due to the generational attitude changes mentioned above, and also because in order to live the lifestyle they want, it is necessary. Gone are the days when every girl wanted to marry the H.S sweetheart and start popping out babies…for most. There are 18 Fortune 500 Company CEO’s. That’s a record high. It is said the 40 percent of workforce managers are women also. I don’t see this as men going anywhere. I think we (both sexes) are learning that each has strengths and weaknesses and how to use them together for success.
    As far as this “complete equality” idea goes where it seems that every box must be checked on an imaginary fairness list somewhere, I believe women do themselves a great disservice here. There is indeed a difference between the sexes. Women were blessed with the capability to reproduce. Of course they need what a man has to do it, but regardless, some women find great joy in being stay at home parents if they can. To many times I see and hear in the media other women disparaging them for it. Not every woman is the same. Many of the women’s magazines are published or edited by women. Airbrushed perfect bodies, how to give your man mind-blowing orgasm articles, stick thin runway models, and the list goes on. As long as women are buying and selling this, acting it out, and passing it on to their daughters you will go nowhere. There is also no doubt that women are sexy. How many use this to get ahead instead of using the talent they have because it’s faster? I blame this type of thing on a lack of self-esteem, which I believe is measured by the millions of breast enhancements, and other plastic surgeries that are done yearly. I realize men do it also, but not nearly to the extent women do.
    I guess in the end what I am saying is that times are indeed changing. It’s not about the end of anyone, but a new start for everyone. And most importantly, I think that women should smarten up and realize that it’s okay to have different points of view and desires from each other and quit beating every woman they disagree with up.

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  4. I think that the only people that gain from talk like this, are the writers and researchers that have something to gain from the talk. At this point in my life, my wife is doing better then me career wise, educationally, and financially. The thing about this is, is that I love it! I feel no concept of inferiority because my wife is doing better then me, I embrace it and boast about it. There probably is a large section of the population that is challenged by this notion of women doing better then men but it is mind boggling for me to see that point of view.
    In both the op ed and video, there appears to be an outcry for men to now have to pick up the slack. I see this as a time now to embrace the women in our lives to go after their dreams and be the best person that they can be regardless of how the other sex will view their actions.

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    Replies
    1. Hi Christopher,
      Kudos to you and P above. But know, when you write “I see this as a time now to embrace the women in our lives to go after their dreams and be the best person that they can be regardless of how the other sex will view their actions” that you are actually supporting what the speakers on the panel had to say. They urge men to “pick up the slack” by doing exactly what you have. The problem is many men would have great trouble with this idea because it threatens their very definitions of self. As we've discussed in class, the type of man threatened by women's moves to equality and away from traditional definitions and roles, is typically one whose sense of himself as a man depends upon women being, well, women -- traditional women, that is. This type of man needs women to be what he rejects or is not (i.e. women are weak, men are strong; women need protected, men protect; women are homemakers, men are breadwinners; women are emotional, men are stoic; women are nurturers, men are leaders, etc.). See what I mean -- a constant that is woman/this is man dichotomy has been the way of male self-definition for centuries, but not always. When a man defines himself this way, and many men do, they feel threatened at the core when women don't play their part, meet those traditional standards of womanhood. It threatens this type of man's very sense of self and place in the world. What will he do, who will he be if women aren’t womanly according to those old ideas?
      The panelists in arguing for a "bucking up" are asking men to abandon this way of being so that we can all grow, so that we can all make more individual and personal choices about the directions our lives take and about how we define ourselves. Your own experience proves that when women step outside the old box of “womanhood,” it doesn't have to mean the end of men, it can mean a better way for all of us. But for women to succeed in these new roles, for men and women to relate in these new ways of being, men must, must, must step outside their old box of “manhood” as well! You have.

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  5. Great points Dr. B but what about this perspective. What if the career minded woman has a child and since she is the bread winner, it is decided that the father stay at home to care for the baby. What are your thoughts about a woman being resentful that the father is the one nurturing the child instead of heading out into the work force so the mother can nurture the child? I have read circumstances about this and would like to know what your thoughts are about a gender role reversal reversal!!?

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